In this episode, we sit down with Emmett, Youth Organizer at Outright Vermont, for a powerful conversation about the role of young people in shaping political and social justice movements. Emmett shares insights into what youth organizing looks like on the ground, why affirming trans youth is a collective responsibility, and how adults can truly show up—by listening, believing, and staying curious. Tune in for a moving reminder that youth aren’t just the future—they’re leading right now.
Guest Info:
Emmett Wiggins (he/him) is a second-year youth organizer with Outright Vermont, where he works to build safe and affirming spaces for LGBTQ+ youth across the state. Born and raised in Vermont, he’s pursuing a career in psychology, with the intention of supporting queer youth as a counselor and continuing advocacy work. Emmett lives with his small family and his dog, and outside of school and organizing, he enjoys tabletop role-playing games, creating art, exploring nature, and building community through play.
Host Info:
Chynah Rae Boise (she/her) is a licensed clinician specializing in complex developmental trauma. With a decade of experience in community mental health, she has worked to advance trauma-informed care, particularly for the most vulnerable populations. In December of 2023, Chynah joined the Child Welfare Training Partnership. She remains committed to learning and contributing to the collective efforts in trauma care, racial equity, and child welfare.
Show Notes and Resources:
Transcript:
Chynah Boise (00:02):
Hello, I’m Chynah Boise and you’re listening to the Social Work Lens. The Social Work lens is a collaboration between the University of Vermont’s Child Welfare Training partnership and the state of Vermont. Today we have another very exciting guest in the studio with us, one of outright Vermont’s youth organizers. I’m going to let this youth organizer introduce himself.
Emmett (00:25):
Hello. I am Emmett. I use he him pronouns, and I am a second year youth organizer with Outright Vermont.
Chynah Boise (00:33):
Why is it so important to have youth organizing and to center youth voice and why do you think that youth voice is so important?
Emmett (00:42):
I mean, nobody can, let me think of the best way to say that. I think nobody can describe what you’re experiencing as well as you can ’cause you’re living it and it is your life. It’s a redundant sentence, but you know I think there is a certain impact on adults to hear youth testify what they’re experiencing or what, you know, oppression they’re facing, what discrimination they’re facing in schools or communities at work. I think I’ve seen that it strikes adults a lot harder, I think to see, you know, youth as young as middle school and younger come up you know, outright to speak outs where basically anyone can have the mic and explain something they’ve experienced or something that brings them joy. They can read poetry or tell a story they want to tell. And at these speak outs, I have seen very young youth, like 10 or 11, really recount these horrible experiences of bullying or blatant homophobia, transphobia, racism. And so I think it is really striking to see someone who is so noticeably younger than you say, this is the life I’m living. This is what I am facing. And I think really it can almost kind of snap people to reality, if that makes sense of saying,
Chynah Boise (02:06):
yeah,
Emmett (02:07):
Oh well this is a child, this is a young kid who’s facing X, Y, Z. That’s horrifying. Like, I can’t imagine if that was my kid. I can’t imagine if I was at that age doing this with sort of that lack of agency around what’s happening to you. And I think that’s one of the biggest things I’ve noticed in youth organizing is that it can almost force adults to listen of saying, this child is speaking at you. There is no deniability in the sense that they’re telling you what they’re living.
Chynah Boise (02:39):
Right.
Emmett (02:39):
It’s not coming from a concerned counselor or a friend. This is them speaking to you or to a crowd. This is what they’re living through.
Chynah Boise (02:49):
Right. There’s no agenda, just the truth.
Emmett (02:51):
Mm-Hmm <affirmative>. Yeah. Mm-Hmm <affirmative>. I think it can feel very personal.
Chynah Boise (02:54):
Yeah, absolutely. Can you tell me a little bit more about what the Youth Organizer program is?
Emmett (03:00):
Yeah. The Youth Organizer program is separated into three campaigns. We have the gender affirming Resources campaign, or GAR as we call it, like the fish. We have the Youth Power and Education campaign or YPE. And we have the Emergence campaign, which does not have a fun shortened title yet.
Chynah Boise (03:18):
Darn <laugh>.
Emmett (03:20):
Maybe this next year we’ll get a fun shortening for emergence. I think gender affirming resource is pretty self-explanatory. Outright has a program to distribute gender affirm resources to youth across the state, but also as far south as Georgia. I don’t wanna say nationwide and get that wrong, but if they can mail it to you, you can get gender affirming resources from them and they provide binders, gaffes, trans tape, anything you could need in that realm for youth who can’t afford it. Or maybe their family’s not supportive of them or maybe they just want it and this is the easiest way they can get it. They don’t have to be at a disadvantage. It’s actually how I got my first binder. So it is a very special program to me for that. It helped me, I guess begin to explore my identity. Youth power and education helps uplift youth voices in schools. It’s very self-explanatory. The emergence campaign works on emerging topics. I mean it’s also a very direct name. I think. This past year under the new administration, we have been working to answer youth questions and I think we’ve seen youth be very scared in these questions. There was a large survey that outright did and we collected the responses from that survey and youth are scared, kind of end of sentence. But we took these questions and we said, okay, who can we ask and who can we get the best answer from? So we got to very specially meet with Vermont’s Attorney General. I led that meeting. I’m so excited about it still. And it happened in March. <Laugh>,
Chynah Boise (05:04):
We love Attorney General Clark here.
Emmett (05:05):
We love Attorney General Clark <laugh> and we got to ask her a lot of legal questions. You know, are trans kids losing access to healthcare? No, not right now. We’re in a very safe state. We have pretty solid laws around it. And getting to have someone in that high position of power explain how it will be okay or what steps they’re taking to protect trans youth is amazing. I don’t think it’s something you get to hear a lot. And the emergence campaign is still ongoing. It is a campaign that will likely spread multiple years of youth organizing. You can tell it’s the campaign I’m a part of because I can talk a lot about it <laugh>. But yeah, the program is separated into these three campaigns with these three focus points. And the campaigns do interact. Obviously we’re all youth organizers together. But generally if you are in that campaign, you are focusing on that topic or that goal for the month or the year or the quarter. And I would say the time when youth organizers all work together, like in one meeting or under one roof so to speak, is for the yearly events that outright hosts. That youth organizers really, I don’t know, take the lead for I guess I would say. One of those being the GSA conference in November usually. And last year youth organizers and youth working with EDJCO on the Education Justice Coalition worked together to create so many workshops for the GSA conference. I, along with another youth organizer and one of the adults working outright led a mutual aid workshop educating youth on the importance of mutual aid examples in their communities, what they wanna see. And that is one of like 15 workshops we did. There were so many. I was kind of bummed I couldn’t sit in on other ones ’cause there were so many cool ones. But yeah, the big part of the GSA conference is making these workshops and that’s sort of the job of youth organizers for that event. The other, well, there’s two other big yearly events outright hosts that youth organizers, you know, take center stage for. One of those is leadership day.
Chynah Boise (07:28):
Mm-Hmm <affirmative>.
Emmett (07:29):
Which was actually changed this past March to be sort of a focus group of youth who get to go into the state house and meet with these legislators, sit in on these committee meetings. And we got to meet with the attorney general, which I mentioned earlier. Another group of youth got to meet with the Secretary of Education at the same time. We also got to meet with the human Rights Commission, Big Hartman.
Chynah Boise (07:54):
mm-hmm <affirmative>.
Emmett (07:55):
And it was a really fun day. I could rave a lot about that. But that was mainly for youth organizers as well as youth with EDJCO as well as a handful of youth who were not a part of these like activism internships that still wanted to participate. And hopefully we get more youth this upcoming year or I guess next year technically. And the third big event that youth organizers help anchor is outright summit. Although this past year it also changed to be a sort of half day prom.
Chynah Boise (08:29):
mm-hmm <affirmative>.
Emmett (08:29):
And with that shift there is less work for youth organizers to do on it. But I think it does, I don’t know, I think it’s a necessary shift in the sense that it is shifting somewhat away from activism of what old summits may have looked like. But it centers joy of saying, Hey, we’re gonna be together for, you know, six hours and we’re gonna get ready for prom together and we’re gonna dance together. We’re gonna eat a lot of cake. We’re gonna feel a little sick after we’re gonna be okay.
Chynah Boise (08:58):
<laugh>.
Chynah Boise (08:59):
But it is sort of fully focusing on community and joy. And I think, at least for me, I can’t speak for anyone else. For me it was very nice to have a day where it was just, you know, even as a youth organizer, I’m at this outright event and I’m just having fun.
Chynah Boise (09:16):
Yeah.
Emmett (09:16):
.I’m here to see people in my community meet new people, dance a lot, mess up a conga line, you know,
Chynah Boise (09:23):
<laugh>.
Emmett (09:23):
a lot of really fun experiences. And yeah, I think a lot of youth need a day of just joy. Maybe we’re not thinking about politics and maybe that is a okay because hey, you can’t do it every day.
Chynah Boise (09:41):
so true.
Emmett (09:42):
You need the half day proms and the beach days with friends just as much as you need to go out and protest. It’s a work-life balance, I guess.
Chynah Boise (09:50):
Yeah. <Laugh>.
Emmett (09:51):
activism, life balance. <Laugh>
Chynah Boise (09:53):
it’s so interesting Emmett as you say that it, I was thinking to myself particularly as you were talking about getting those survey results and reading about youth spheres and I was thinking, woo, that’s a lot for a young person to hold. And, and I feel like I as an adult am often reckoning with that idea of like, oh, I wish that youth wouldn’t have to hold this much. And even though I wish that it doesn’t mean that you don’t have to.
Emmett (10:24):
mm-hmm <affirmative>.
Chynah Boise (10:24):
It doesn’t mean that you’re not feeling driven to, to do that work. And so I think that as adults we often wanna protect you can’t tell listeners, can’t tell them doing air quotes but protect youth from the harsh realities of the world. But you’re in it with us.
Emmett (10:42):
Mm-Hmm <affirmative>.
Chynah Boise (10:43):
And, and I’m glad as saddened as I am to hear that you are, that you are feeling like you have to take up this mantle and do this very hard work. I am glad to hear that you are balancing it with these moments of joy and with community and you are able to find hope perhaps.
Emmett (11:03):
Mm-Hmm <affirmative>. I like that word. I think hope is really fitting hope rest.
Chynah Boise (11:08):
Yeah.
Emmett (11:08):
You know, mentally or physically both. Ideally comfort.
Chynah Boise (11:13):
Mm-Hmm <affirmative>.
Emmett (11:13):
In friends or hobbies or what have you. Peace. Although I think that might just be hope repackaged and a sense of safety.
Chynah Boise (11:23):
Yeah. Can you say more about that?
Emmett (11:25):
I mean, in this, you know, political climate as we are living through it, I think there is a lot of fear around safety, especially for and trans youth, especially for transgender youth. And so I think, at least in my experience and you know, in the people close to me experiences we have really been seeking out, you know, these, these places of comfort or these moments of safety or, you know, peace and quiet. And I think that’s good to see. Obviously I think it’s good to seek out things that comfort and heal you. I think it is sad to kind of see sort of, of having to, I don’t wanna say overcompensate, I don’t know if that’s the perfect word. It’s hard to be living through a time where you feel like you almost need to constantly self-regulate or self-soothe.
Chynah Boise (12:18):
Yeah. That’s well said. That’s well said. Wow. I really appreciate you sharing that. And, and it also makes me wonder too you’re generating so many thoughts for me. And this was also true of our, of our meeting prior. I wanted to circle back to, you know, we had talked about how I had done a previous series on gender affirming care. A lot of the premise of that series really ended up being that gender affirming care can be so many things.
Emmett (12:51):
mm-hmm <affirmative>.
Chynah Boise (12:51):
And is not limited to medical transition. It’s not limited to GAR, even though GAR is great. And I’m so glad to hear that this youth organizing campaign exists for that. I think that that’s so impactful. And I wanna hear from you in terms of the scope of gender affirming care and how we can hold our trans friends. Maybe not just youth, but you know, in general what does gender affirming care look like for you? What are your thoughts on that?
Emmett (13:23):
I have socially and started medically transitioning. I think when people think about gender affirming care, they immediate immediately go to the medical side of it, right. Of hormones and surgeries and these, you know, irreversible things.
Chynah Boise (13:42):
Again, air quotes, <laugh>.
Emmett (13:44):
yes, air quotes, irreversible things. But I think gender affirming care is very broad. I think it’s also a very individual thing. I know for me, gender affirming care is not at all limited to the traditional things of HRT, although that has been invaluable in my experience as who I am. But the first thing I did before I even fully accepted myself as transgender while I was really struggling and grappling with my identity is I got a short haircut. Which I think is what a lot of people will say their first step was. And in hindsight, not my best haircut, but it was a very big step for me. ’cause Up until that point I had had hair past my shoulders for the majority of my life. And just that one step of saying, you know, I’m getting a shorter haircut when I go to the salon this week, changed so much for me. And it was such a small piece. You know, this $40 haircut shifted how I view myself. It made it easier to interact in groups ’cause I felt like I was interacting more as me and rather as some shell or some mask I was putting on. And that is part of social transition generally of getting a haircut, switching out your wardrobe trying out a new name or new pronouns. And I was pretty content with socially transitioning. i did it very slowly. I did it over the course of two years about, and I’m very lucky to be surrounded by friends and loved ones who have almost across the board supported me. And I don’t know, sort of met me where I’m at of me saying, Hey, I’m trying out the name Emmett, or I’m trying out they them pronouns today. And no one would care. It’s fine. No one’s looking at me weird. It’s not a huge change. But it was a huge change to me for where I was. And you know, now I have been out to my friends for around four years. My family for only two, sorry guys, <laugh>, it’s more intimidating to, to talk to.
Chynah Boise (16:04):
totally.
Emmett (16:05):
with close family. And just back in April I started hormone replacement therapy. So I am generally very content with where I am now. I’m happy with my trajectory or my five year plan. But I think now that I don’t need to, I don’t know the best way to say this, I would say now that I don’t need to work really hard to feel comfortable being me it has just given me more mental capacity to do so many more, way more enjoyable things than worry about who I am. And I feel like I can leave it at that honestly.
Chynah Boise (16:49):
Yeah. Yeah. That’s great. Thank you for sharing that. I have two more questions if you’re feeling up for it.
Emmett (16:57):
Okay.
Chynah Boise (16:58):
My ultimate question, my second to last question is looking, looking again at the program outright and you’re going into your second year.
Emmett (17:09):
mm-hmm <affirmative>.
Chynah Boise (17:09):
Organizing. What kind of hopes do you have or, or what are your expectations going into this year?
Emmett (17:16):
I’m really excited about this second year of the emergence campaign. ‘Cause This was a campaign created last year and we’ll hopefully be continuing as long as the youth organizers wanna continue it. But we have this long-term goal of getting these youth questions answered by people in the applicable fields. Like I mentioned the Attorney General we interviewed a med student about access to gender affirming care and her experience, you know, working in that field, working with trans youth. And we, fingers crossed, get to have so many more cool interviews with so many more cool people. And it’s not, this is up in the air. I don’t, I don’t wanna say something that might not happen, but our hope is to have sort of a, a frequently asked questions page.
Chynah Boise (18:11):
Mm-Hmm <affirmative>.
Emmett (18:12):
Or yeah. Our hope is to just have an easy way to access those interviews. Whether that is written out as a transcript or, you know, audio, video embedded. Just have those resources super easy to access for youth. Write on the website or right linked on the Instagram. You know, so a youth can go and say, I’m really worried about legal protections.
Chynah Boise (18:39):
Yeah.
Emmett (18:40):
I can listen to our state’s attorney general talk about it and what they’re doing to protect it. And she made it very clear that they will fight for it. And I think that’s a message that youth need to hear. They need to hear that people in these positions of power are willing to actually fight and deliver on promises. And in general, I’m just really excited for youth organizing. It’s, it’s such a fun program with so many cool people. I’m very excited to see the returners. I know a handful of people are coming back for a second or third year. I’m really excited to meet all the new people. We have five full day trainings over the course of the internship and the first one is coming up in September. I’m so excited. <Laugh>, I can’t wait. ’cause It’s just good company and really good catered lunch. And it is, I think one of my favorite ways to be in community because you are, you know, working toward some overarching goal. Which usually isn’t fully established at our first training.
Chynah Boise (19:51):
Sure.
Emmett (19:52):
But it’s to me, the ultimate group of like-minded people who just happened to be really cool and awesome and into activism. And I don’t know, I feel like I may have just repeated like, community is so important in a thousand different ways. It’s that important. Truly if it wasn’t clear, it is that important.
Chynah Boise (20:15):
Yeah.
Emmett (20:17):
yeah, I think the Youth Organizer program especially working alongside the Education Justice Coalition has been one of the coolest ways I’ve met people who share my interests, who are in my age group and who care. I think it attracts people who care more than just surface level. Like, I think this is wrong.
Chynah Boise (20:41):
Right.
Emmett (20:41):
That’s good. It is wrong. What are we gonna do about it?
Chynah Boise (20:45):
Right.
Emmett (20:45):
And we’re gonna brainstorm it. Amazing.
Chynah Boise (20:47):
That’s amazing. That’s incredible. Ugh. Yeah. I really just want to continue to talk about how amazing and incredible you are <laugh>. And you and I talked a little bit about ending on a really big question. And that really big question is what do you wish adults knew about L-G-B-T-Q, youth, youth, or what do you wish that adults would do more of or do differently in service to or to uplift youth? What were your thoughts on that?
Emmett (21:22):
I think the biggest thing adults can do is just listen to youth recognize their wants and their needs. And I think meet them where they’re at, if that makes sense. Because I can recognize that adults can, or I guess I suppose they are quick to dismiss, especially younger youth because kind of solely because of age. And at least for me, it was such a massive game changer when, you know, I was just speaking to adults and they were listening and they were absorbing that and they took action for what I wanted. And I think that’s the biggest thing an adult can do to show that they care for a youth is to listen and recognize what the youth is actually saying and say, okay, what can I do? And I think that question of what can I do is really important also. ’cause I think it is easy to hear someone’s problem and say, oh, I know what I can do to help you. And that’s not a bad first response. That’s, you know, amazing that you wanna help them, but you’re not asking What the youth actually wants. And it can take that step into overbearing or, you know, well-meaning, but unhelpful. And so if you can listen to a youth and then say, wow, that’s a lot. What do you want from me? Or like, where can I help you? Or do you even want my help? Did you just want me to listen? You know, I think being heard is or will be hopefully will be so, so important for so many young and trans people especially around identity.
Chynah Boise (23:07):
Right.
Emmett (23:07):
People get dismissed with the whole, it’s just a phase thing that is ridiculous. <Laugh> That is completely dismissive of someone’s life and experiences. And sometimes it is as simple as just saying, okay, what can I do? Do you want me to use a new name? Do you want me to do, you know, pay for your haircut offer the help, don’t force the help, please. It’s well-meaning, but it could be taken very, very wrong.
Chynah Boise (23:40):
Yeah. That’s awesome. I think that’s really important for adults to hear because we do tend to wanna be problem solvers, <laugh>, and we do tend to think we have all the answers. So listen and be curious and ask before we assume Absolutely. Is there anything else that you would like to say before we end our time today?
Emmett (24:07):
Ooh. I mean, thank you for having me. This is such a fun thing to do. This is an example of community. Here we go, <laugh>. We’re in community right now.
Chynah Boise (24:17):
We are.
Emmett (24:18):
And I think it’s really nice to talk about this stuff. You know, this is a more formal way of doing it, but I don’t know. I feel, I feel honored as the, the youth who’s being listened to. It has been fun. Thank you. And yeah, I don’t know. This is awesome.
Chynah Boise (24:37):
Well, gosh I should be thanking you. We should all be thanking you for sharing your time with us in, in the studio today, as well as all of the time that you’ve devoted to our community out in practice. I think that that’s incredible and I can’t wait to see where you go from here. I know that I’m gonna be keeping tabs on your name in the news. Yeah. And thank you so much for spending time with me, with all of us.
Emmett (25:06):
Thank you. This has been such a good time.
Chynah Boise (25:09):
I’m so glad. I think that we can call that a wrap.
Cassie Gillespie (25:16):
The social work lens is produced by the University of Vermont’s Child Welfare Training Partnership and the State of Vermont. Our theme music is composed and performed by local band Brick Drop, and our sound production and engineering has been brought to you by Egan Media Productions. We’d also like to give a special thank you to our in-house administrative production assistant, Emma Baird. For the Social Work Lens, I’m Cassie Gillespie, and we’ll see you next time.